Trailers / Trailering

Catalina Direct Discussion Topics / Catalina 22 Discussion Area / Trailers / Trailering / Trailer needed for Cat 22 w/fixed keel
 
 
Author Trailer needed for Cat 22 w/fixed keel
Wes Sherrill
Concord, NC

Boat Name: Summer Breeze

Model/Year: C 22/1988 fin keel

Hull No. 14333

Hailing Port: Lake Tillery, NC
10/15/2009 9:24 PM Pacific Time

After years of wanting a sailboat, I just bought a 1988 Cat 22 with a fixed keel. It is in excellant shape. My family and I are very excitied. The owner did not have a trailer. I need to move it about 65 miles to another lake. I would rather buy a used trailer than pay someone an arm & a leg to move it. Also, the boat will be left in the water but I think I need the trailer for routine maintenance/cleaning. After searching the internet and dealerships for the past week, I have learned it is very difficult or impossible to find a trailer for this boat. Do I need a trailer with brakes only to haul it 60 miles every couple of years? Single or tandem? Please let me know if you have or know someone who has a trailer for sale. I'm willing to drive 4 to 6 hours from Charlotte, NC. Contact me at [email protected]. Thanks!
Wes Sherrill
Concord, NC

Boat Name: Summer Breeze

Model/Year: C 22/1988 fin keel

Hull No. 14333

Hailing Port: Lake Tillery, NC
10/15/2009 9:43 PM Pacific Time

Also, how difficult is it to launch and load a fixed keel boat verses a swing keel? The lake I am on does not have any lifts so I willl have to float it. Am I going to be sorry that I bought a fixed keel even though I will only haul it 60 miles once every couple of years? I knew there were fixed and swing keel boats but never really thought about how tall the boat sat on a trailer and the depth of water required to float it until I started looking for a trailer and reading your forum. I have been around motorboats all my life and have sailed a Hobie Cat a few times but this is my first 'real' sailboat. This is a new experience. Please pardon the rookies questions.
Peter
South Daytona, Florida

Boat Name: (Working On A Name)

Model/Year: C-22, 1974

Hull No. 2679

Hailing Port: South Daytona, Florida
10/16/2009 10:59 AM Pacific Time

Hi Wes, I know there are others who are better qualified to answer these questions. As to brakes on the trailer depends on what you're going to pull it with (how heavy a vehicle). I have a Chevy Explorer conversion van (350) weighing in at 6,000 plus lbs. It doesn’t care if the boat is back there or not. The swing keel has more maintenance issues than the full keel. I would suggest finding a regular trailer sized to fit the C-22 and have someone weld the necessary supports for bunks to fit the full keel. I can send you some pictures of trailers for a C-22 with a full keel. Perhaps you can find someone who has a trailer you can borrow. Hopefully you have a deep ramp. I often times have to use the trailer winch to let the trailer out far enough to float the boat off and then winch the trailer back to the truck and recouple. If you think it through, it works pretty good. Don’t let the winch handle go! Personally, I wouldn't mind having a full keel myself.
David Torrisi
Santa Clara, CA

Boat Name: Dumbo

Model/Year: 1975 C-22

Hull No. 4330

Hailing Port: Santa Clara
10/16/2009 2:20 PM Pacific Time

Wes,
It may help to know that just about any trailer for a similar draft/length boat will likely work for you. Most have adjustable pads. The weight of the boat should be on the keel and the pads just keep it from tipping, unlike the swing which sits on the bunks.
Everyone has an opinion on brakes and tow vehicles. My opinion is that if you are driving short distances infrequently, you can usually get away without them. Just leave lots of room in front and sides for stopping. Your local laws are likely specific as to the rules on brakes. Launching a fin keel on a ramp is done quite frequently and with ease if you know the tricks. Find a local J24 or other fin keel trailer sailor on your lake to get the inside scoop. The biggest trick is keeping your trailer on the ramp, if it's long enough. I've seen folks get their trailer wheels stuck after the end of the ramp and it ain't pretty. Usually, the trailer is connected to the tow vehicle by a length of cable or webbing to get the trailer in deep enough to float the boat.
Google this string and you'll find more answers to your questions:
trailer launching fin keel

Fair winds,
David
Howard Friedman
Pisgah Forest, NC

Boat Name: Forspacious Seas

Model/Year: Wing - 1989

Hull No. 14907

Hailing Port: Lake Keowee-Seneca, SC
10/16/2009 3:40 PM Pacific Time

When you say "fixed keel", are you talking about a fin keel or a wing keel as there is quite a height difference between the two? The only difference between the swing and wing is the height of the bunks. On mine, the uprights are bolted to the chassis and can be replaced with longer ones that any trailer shop can fabricate cheaply. There needs to be a floor board for the keel to rest on. About 60% of boat weight should be on the keel and the rest on the bunks. The forward V-Block and winch position has to be adjusted for the new height. Back in 2002, I sold the late Dick King my old wing keel trailer for his new boat. He had the 4 uprights replaced for a very low price and it worked like a charm after adjustments were made. I would think that a fin keel could be handled the same way but I have no experience with that. Obviously there are many more used swing keel trailers out there so it would be beneficial to make a conversion. The best way to set up your trailer is to have the boat lifted on a sling and held in place while you make all adjustments. Remember that tongue weight is very important and has to do with where you position the front
V-Block, positioning the boat fore and aft.
I have had both types of trailers. Single axle usually has a larger wheel than tandems but tilts more readily to let the boat float off. The tandem has also worked fine and gives me more stability on the road but both performed well. I had extendable tongues on both and I think this is a very important option.
Hope this helps.
Wes Sherrill
Concord, NC

Boat Name: Summer Breeze

Model/Year: C 22/1988 fin keel

Hull No. 14333

Hailing Port: Lake Tillery, NC
10/16/2009 6:22 PM Pacific Time

Thanks Peter, David and Howard. It has a fin keel. You are right it is easier to find a trailer for a swing keel than a fixed keel. I have thought about buying a swing keel trailer but not sure how I would logistically make the conversion. The boat is presently in the water. Do I get the boat on the trailer, block up the hull so it sits pretty level (I assume the bunks will be too low); carefully haul it to home or to a metal shop, measure and make the new supports? Or is there some way to modify the swing keel trailer prior to sitting the boat on the trailer? Ideally I would like to be able to use a trailer that I presently have for a 19' inboard/ outboard. I could bolt on bunk supports and a keel support when I need to haul the C22. I think this would be even more tricky getting the boat on the trailer for the first time so measurements could be made. Thoughts on how to logistically make the conversion?
Lynn Buchanan
Nevada City, CA

Boat Name: SAILYNN

Model/Year: SWING 1984

Hull No. 11994

Hailing Port: SCOTTS FLAT LAKE, CA
10/16/2009 10:39 PM Pacific Time

Ditto's to the information given. Since you already have the boat in the water and said you wouldn't need to pull it for a few years, you may want to keep looking for a trailer. We bought a C22 without a trailer and kept it in the water till I found a double axle fin keel trailer that had belonged to a Santana 25 for $900. We did the opposite and reduced the bunk height with simple welding and installed new bunks as opposed to pads. I would follow your state law on trailer brake and tie down requirements, because the risk vs. cost of not following the law is very disporportinate. As far as launching, if you do it often like Santana 20, J24 and Capri 22 racers do, you will develop a very quick system once the boat sits on the trailer properly. Doing it every year or so will be more of a challenge than the guys that do it weekly. Try to find some C22 sailors at your lake, or make friends with any sailors at your lake "we're family" and you will find out how willing they will be to help a newbie out. Good Luck!
Wes Sherrill
Concord, NC

Boat Name: Summer Breeze

Model/Year: C 22/1988 fin keel

Hull No. 14333

Hailing Port: Lake Tillery, NC
10/17/2009 6:03 AM Pacific Time

I need a trailer now. The boat is on the 'wrong' lake and has to be moved in the next 2 to 3 weeks. It will cost me $500 to have someone move it which would be a good chunk of a trailer cost.
Linda Hoffecker
Lancaster, PA

Boat Name: t/c

Model/Year: '82 Cat 22

Hull No. t/c

Hailing Port: Havre de Grace, MD
10/18/2009 7:27 AM Pacific Time

Just a thought: Would it be possible for you to go to the 'right' lake and find someone there who has the same or similar kind of keel that you have and borrowing or renting their trailer?? I did that to tow a boat home from Mayo, MD to Havre de Grace. They had to make a few mods (to stabilize it on the bunks but not earth shattering) but once the boat was launched they just took off the extra pieces of lumber that they had screwed into the bunks and it was back to its old self in no time. Even if you have to pay $2-300, it's saving you money.
Good luck....Usually sailboaters get great joy out of helping others in tuff jams.
Erv Zimmerman
Anchor Bay Shores, Michigan

Boat Name: Adventuring

Model/Year: 1973

Hull No. 1787

Hailing Port: Anchor Bay, Lake St. Clair
10/18/2009 2:04 PM Pacific Time

The first factor to be considered to determine if brakes are required is the laws in the state where it will be registered. Some states require brakes on all trailers and others in those over a minimum weight. Keep in mind the weight includes both the weight of the trailer and the cargo (boat).

A quick Google search turned up this on state towing requirements spreadsheet of requirements:

http://www.loadrite.com/Support/Tow_Vehicle_Requirements/State_by_State_Towing_Laws/69/

According to this chart, NC requires brakes on trailers of 4000lbs and over. If this is the case, you could probably get away without trailer brakes. The only way to be sure is to check with your state Department of Transportation.

Many people (myself included) have towed C22s on trailers without brakes and experienced no problems. I added surge brakes to my trailer several years ago and they definitely make a significant difference when towing at highway speeds.

Almost any trailer with the capacity to haul the boat and a pan/bed/bunk for the keel to rest on (sufficiently low to keep the center of gravity and overall height low) could be modified for the purpose. The limited time you have to move the boat complicates the problem.

The last time I moved a boat without a trailer (25 years ago) I made adjustable bunks out of lumber bolted together and rented a flatbed trailer ($15/hr -I’m sure it would cost MUCH more today, if you can find a trailer to rent). I was moving the boat a fairly short distance and the whole process took under 4 hours (including picking up and returning the trailer).

I floated the boat onto the trailer, until the keel just rested on the trailer bed and bolted the bunk supports together under the boat, making a few final adjustments after the boat was completely out of the water.

I realize this may not be applicable to your circumstances, but it may spawn other solutions. Good luck & hope you enjoy your new boat!

IMPORTANT: When handling heavy objects, stay out from under them as much as possible and, if they get away from you, get out of the way and let them fall!
Wes Sherrill
Concord, NC

Boat Name: Summer Breeze

Model/Year: C 22/1988 fin keel

Hull No. 14333

Hailing Port: Lake Tillery, NC
10/18/2009 7:42 PM Pacific Time

Thanks for the suggestion Linda, that is a good idea. Unfortunately there is only about a dozen sailboats on the 'our' lake and most folks have packed it up for the winter(wimps). I talked to the marina near where the boat is presently located and they know of a portable welding company that can come to the marina and modify a trailer while the boat is held above by a sling/lift. This eliminates my eariler concerns about how to logistically modify a swing keel trailer for a fixed keel. This opens up my options to either a swing keel or fixed keel trailer. So now I am searching for either type. Which is better bunks or individual pads? (I'll check for previous discussions). Again I will only use the trailer to haul it initialy and then for perodic maintenance. I don't think I have enough guts to make supports out of wood.
Peter
South Daytona, Florida

Boat Name: (Working On A Name)

Model/Year: C-22, 1974

Hull No. 2679

Hailing Port: South Daytona, Florida
10/19/2009 7:41 AM Pacific Time

Wes, not sure if you need these or want them as reference, but here's a link to Hull #3 which is a fin keel on a trailer. Again, I have some more pictures of a later model (1986 or newer) but I'll need your email address.
Kip C
Cincinnati, Ohio

Boat Name: Knot Work / Quietude

Model/Year: '86 Cat 22 / '90 Cat 25

Hull No. 13358 / 6021

Hailing Port: Brookville Lake, Indiana
10/19/2009 8:19 AM Pacific Time

Wes,
I know your looking for used, but just incase, Sail-Trailers, in Georga, build basic new ones for about $1500. Since your in NC, I thought I'd let you know. Good Luck.
Kip C
Cincinnati, Ohio

Boat Name: Knot Work / Quietude

Model/Year: '86 Cat 22 / '90 Cat 25

Hull No. 13358 / 6021

Hailing Port: Brookville Lake, Indiana
10/19/2009 8:22 AM Pacific Time

Forgot to give you a link:

http://home.att.net/~sail-trailers/sailboat-trailer.html
Howard Friedman
Pisgah Forest, NC

Boat Name: Forspacious Seas

Model/Year: Wing - 1989

Hull No. 14907

Hailing Port: Lake Keowee-Seneca, SC
10/19/2009 11:05 AM Pacific Time

Wes- bunks are recommended for the C-22 by the factory and almost all of the trailers I've see for these boats are bunks. They support the hull more evenly and are easy to set up for weight distribution. Many of the trailers I've seen have four bolt-on supports for the bunks-two on each side. They are height adjustable so there is no need for welding. You just need to get the apprx. lengths and adjust to the exact measurement. As I stated previously, you can contact the company that made the trailer you're thinking of buying and they will size and cut uprights for you. If the company is out of business-like Performance Trailers- you can probably find a local shop to cut and galvanize some uprights. Holding the boat over the trailer on a sling is definitely the easiest way to adjust the bunks. Remember, you want most of the weight on the keel board.
David Torrisi
Santa Clara, CA

Boat Name: Dumbo

Model/Year: 1975 C-22

Hull No. 4330

Hailing Port: Santa Clara
10/19/2009 12:18 PM Pacific Time

Wes,
I found a link to show you how it works at the ramp with a fixed keel:
http://www.schrothfiberglass.com/Ramp%20launching.htm
Not sure I'd use rope but that's the idea.

Howard: Most swing keel boats have bunk trailers to support the weight of the whole boat. Wes' is a fixed fin keel and I feel would be better suited with 4 pads as most fin keel boats use these with the bulk of the weight being supported by the keel.
David
Wes Sherrill
Concord, NC

Boat Name: Summer Breeze

Model/Year: C 22/1988 fin keel

Hull No. 14333

Hailing Port: Lake Tillery, NC
10/20/2009 9:44 PM Pacific Time

Thanks to all that responded to my request on how to select and find the right trailer for my boat. After checking with dealers and looking on Craigslist in NC, SC, GA part of TN, VA and FL for the past 2 weeks, I gave up trying to find a used trailer and ordered a trailer from Sail Trailers in Columbus GA. I had read good reviews about their trailers and since I only needed it to pull the boat out for periodic maintenance, I wanted to keep the cost down. I went with pads instead of bunks due to the infrequent hauling of the boat and the ease of cleanig the bottom with pads. As David mentioned almost all the weight is on the keel.Kip, the cost is a little higher now, $1750 for a single axle,add another $175 for keel guide and $175 tongue extension, still a bargin. I'll let you know later if this was a good decision.
Thanks again for all your help. I'm sure you will see me ask dumb questions in the future as I learn more about the boat and how to do things the right way. This Forum is a great tool. (I just wish it had spell check!)
Lynn Buchanan
Nevada City, CA

Boat Name: SAILYNN

Model/Year: SWING 1984

Hull No. 11994

Hailing Port: SCOTTS FLAT LAKE, CA
10/21/2009 9:40 AM Pacific Time

Congratulations on your boat and trailer purchase. A new trailer will give you piece of mind for hauling and will add value to your boat if you every deceide to sell. You may consinder joining the C22 NSA for just $27.50 a year. You get a Catalina 22 only magazine every other month and they have a great Tech. manual on CD for just about every question you would have on your C22. The Tech manual is available only to members but is worth the cost. And the magazine has great articles and you will get lots of phone numbers for questions and suggestions. Hope you get some great sailing in!
David Torrisi
Santa Clara, CA

Boat Name: Dumbo

Model/Year: 1975 C-22

Hull No. 4330

Hailing Port: Santa Clara
10/21/2009 10:06 AM Pacific Time

Wes,
Here are a few more resources for you:
www.catalina22.org
www.c22region10.org/bb
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/catalina22

This class has many helpful folks that love to help out. It's an invaluable resource that you'll soon become a part of.

David
Wes Sherrill
Concord, NC

Boat Name: Summer Breeze

Model/Year: C 22/1988 fin keel

Hull No. 14333

Hailing Port: Lake Tillery, NC
10/21/2009 6:06 PM Pacific Time

Thanks for the suggestions, I'll check them out
 
 
Trailers / Trailering
Catalina Direct Discussion Topics / Catalina 22 Discussion Area / Trailers / Trailering / Trailer needed for Cat 22 w/fixed keel