Boat Name:
Model/Year:
Hull No.
Hailing Port: |
 02/16/2004 6:34 AM Pacific Time
Active as a crew, not an owner. When using a spinnaker pole on the Genoa (in place of a whisker pole), does is it restricted in length to the race measurements of a spinnaker pole of 8 feet or is it allowed to be the 12 foot length of a whisker pole and then have to have the same thickness? The rules don't seem clear.
Some of the people in our fleet are starting to challenge the rules or not.
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Dick King
Melbourne, FL
Boat Name: Twilight Zone
Model/Year: Sport/2005
Hull No. 15546
Hailing Port: Melbourne, FL |
02/16/2004 8:09 AM Pacific Time
Dennis - You need to know under what rules the race is sailed and how your boat is handicapped. The spinnaker pole normally is built as a spinnaker pole, It is J length (8ft) and has bridles for the topping lift and downhaul (foreguy). A whisker pole is used to pole out the genoa when going on a broad reach or a run. It is usually adjustable and for a Catalina 22 you can use either a lightweight (1 inch) or heavy duty (2 inch) 6-12 ft pole. The class rules allow the pole to be extended to 12 ft.
If you are sailing in a PHRF fleet, your base boat rating is determined by your class, sailing with specified equipment. The PHRF base boat rating for a Catalina 22 is nominally 270 sec/mile. Some locations vary. The base boat rating assumes you a using a 155% genoa and a spinnaker. However "pole" length is restricted to "J" (8 ft.). Most locations allow a 12 sec/mi credit for going non spinnaker
If you have a Catalina 22 ODR (One Design Rating) you can fly a 12 foot pole but you cannot take a 12 second credit for sailing without a spinnaker.and your genoa cannot exceed class restrictions (max LP is 150%).
Hope this confusing explanation helps. |
Boat Name:
Model/Year:
Hull No.
Hailing Port: |
02/16/2004 3:16 PM Pacific Time
Thanks for getting back to me
We are sailing in a C-22 non spinnnaker fleet. Our fleet in Phoenix typically has 12 boats on the line, nice to sail this time of the year. We sail with only the main and genoa, occasionally with lots of wind a working jib. People in the fleet are using the spinnaker pole in place of a whisker pole. Thus my question if you use a spinnaker pole to function as a whisker pole to wing on wing with the genoa attached, can the spinnaker pole with fittings be a maximum of 12 feet or the spinnaker pole limit of 8 feet |
Dick King
Melbourne, FL
Boat Name: Twilight Zone
Model/Year: Sport/2005
Hull No. 15546
Hailing Port: Melbourne, FL |
02/16/2004 6:18 PM Pacific Time
As I said before, a spinnaker is usually a fixed length. (8ft for a Catalina 22. If you are using an adjustable lenght pole as a combination whisker pole and spinnaker pole, stretch the sucker out and use it at twelve feet.
We have three poles on board. An 8ft x 2in fixed length spinnaker pole, a 6-12ft x 1 in light weight pole which is extended to 12 ft and taped and a 6-12ft x 2in adjustable length pole that we extend and tape at 12 ft. In heavy air, when we have to switch to the working jib, we use the spinnaker pole for going wing and wing, so we don't have to collapse the 12 ft whisker poles to fit the working jib. |
RJ Tazelaar
Nashville, TN
Boat Name: Gecko
Model/Year: 1984 Catalina 22
Hull No. 12180
Hailing Port: Percy Priest Yacht Club |
02/17/2004 6:08 AM Pacific Time
A spinnaker pole and a whisker pole are not the same thing.
If you're using a pole to hold the genoa out, it's a whisker pole and for the love of all that is good, make sure it's 12' long. Anything shorter isn't going to be as effective.
If you are flying a spinnaker, (which I realize you are not) then the pole should be 8' long. I don't know why anyone would want to use an 8' whisker pole, unless they had nothing else.
I think that answers your question, but if you want more, here it is:
If you are racing in PHRF, then you must decide before the race if you are a spinnaker boat, or if you are not. If you are a spinnaker boat, then you can carry a spinnaker pole, but you may not have a whisker pole on board.
If you are a Non Spinnaker boat, then you may not fly spinnaker. You are allowed to have a whisker pole, and the length of it can be anything you want. 12' makes the most sense, but an 8' spinnaker pole would be better than nothing.
It sounds to me like you are racing other Catalina 22's who are using whisker poles of different lengths. As long as the length doesn't exceed 12', they are legal. (That's if you're racing One Design.)
I hope this helps. |
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Model/Year:
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02/17/2004 6:36 AM Pacific Time
Thank you both for the clarification. Learning more and more about the specific C-22 one design rules. We are luck to have a large number of C-22's that we an race one design. Who gets to the finish first takes it. Sailing is great in AZ for all of you snow bound people. Our next race is 2/28. Temp is 75 today with blue skys.
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Tim Glover
Sutton, Ontario
Boat Name: Omigosh
Model/Year: 1976 swing keel
Hull No. 5491
Hailing Port: Jackson's Point |
02/17/2004 6:29 PM Pacific Time
Now that's just mean Dennis. It warmed up to around 22 today. I took my daughters dog out for a walk around the harbour, and part of our race course this weekend. Of course there's about 16" of ice and lots of fish huts out there. Looking forward to May for our launch date. Good luck with the racing.
Tim |
Dick Reynolds
Lebanon, Oregon
Boat Name: Catnip
Model/Year: Swing Keel / 1974
Hull No. 4570
Hailing Port: Newport, Oregon |
02/17/2004 10:57 PM Pacific Time
One of the questions I have is can you have a topping lift on a whisker pole? A 12' pole 2" in dia. can be a handfull for an old lady. |
Dick King
Melbourne, FL
Boat Name: Twilight Zone
Model/Year: Sport/2005
Hull No. 15546
Hailing Port: Melbourne, FL |
02/18/2004 8:19 AM Pacific Time
Dick - In light air, I have used a topping lift even on the light weight (1 in. ) pole. The topping lift keedps the end of the pole from pulling down on the clew of the genoa and closing up the leach. The only rules I know of have to do with the length of the pole. |
RJ Tazelaar
Nashville, TN
Boat Name: Gecko
Model/Year: 1984 Catalina 22
Hull No. 12180
Hailing Port: Percy Priest Yacht Club |
02/19/2004 11:28 AM Pacific Time
Dick King, why would you want an open leach when you're going downwind? The way I see it, you would want the leach to be tight because it is behaving as a luff. When going downwind, you're in essence reversing the leech and the luff. |
RJ Tazelaar
Nashville, TN
Boat Name: Gecko
Model/Year: 1984 Catalina 22
Hull No. 12180
Hailing Port: Percy Priest Yacht Club |
02/19/2004 11:31 AM Pacific Time
To answer the question... a topping lift is ok to use on the whisker pole, just a little cumbersome. But I think you could get more control over the genoa shape by using one. The question is, what shape is best? |
