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Author Turning Ball
Kurt Green
Lake Villa, IL

Boat Name: Sharon Lee

Model/Year: C22 / 1973

Hull No. 2162

Hailing Port: Great Lakes, IL
03/04/2004 3:51 PM Pacific Time

This weekend I examined the turning ball on my boat and I was a little surprised to see that it does not look like it has been turning at all.

There is a groove slightly worn in it on one side, and no sign of wear elsewhere.

Has anyone else noticed this on their boat?

Thanks!

Kurt Green
s/v Sharon Lee
C22 #2162 Great Lakes IL
http://hometown.aol.com/knights5/myhomepage/svsharonlee.html

Michael Smalter
Webster, NY

Boat Name: Marrakesh

Model/Year: 1986

Hull No. 13645

Hailing Port: Rochester, NY
03/04/2004 5:24 PM Pacific Time

I saw that on my original turning ball. Once it has a flat spot, there is no saving it. Time to buy a new one.

Chip Ford
Marblehead, MA

Boat Name: Chip Ahoy

Model/Year: 1974-Swing Keel

Hull No. CTY032820374

Hailing Port: Marblehead, Mass.
03/05/2004 4:06 AM Pacific Time


While we're on the subject ... !

I just replaced my turning ball, cable and pin, hose and clamps. The cable had been removed by the boatyard when they took off my keel for refinishing, and I've since rebuilt/refinished the winch.

I removed the old hose last fall to inspect the turning ball and it came off easily enough after I released the two hose clamps, with the usual amount of twisting and pulling one expects when removing an old"radiator hose." But, thinking I wouldn't need it again, I threw it away.

The very corroded brass turning-ball was turning, but a bit sticky. I observed that the cable seemed to have been in contact (shiny and slightly worn) at only one point in the otherwise-corroded groove. Not having the cable any more (it was badly frayed and the yard had tossed it), I've deducted that the new cable should run from the winch around THE AFT/BACKSIDE of the turning ball, then down through the tube to the keel. Is this correct?

Also, the new hose seems to be a fraction of an inch too long -- if it's not supposed to reach or come in contact with the winch. My new one touches the winch, though it fits within the spool. Should I cut it down a fraction so it doesn't make any contact?

The new cable has a swaged eye at the end where it will connect to the keel (with the new clevis pin). The other end is bare cable wrapped in tape. First, can I assume, having bought evrything from CD, that the cable is the right length, and; second, it seems there should be something at the bare end of the cable where it is clamped to the winch: am I correct, and if so, what do I need?

Thanks for any and all advice.

Chip Ford --
Marblehead, Mass.
1974 C22 #3282 - "Chip Ahoy"
http://cltg.org/chip_ahoy/
Dick King
Melbourne, FL

Boat Name: Twilight Zone

Model/Year: Sport/2005

Hull No. 15546

Hailing Port: Melbourne, FL
03/05/2004 6:25 AM Pacific Time

Hi Chip - How are you enjoying the "heat wave?"

"But, thinking I wouldn't need it again, I threw it away."

I, being of the packrat persuasion never do that, unless it broken beyond repair. The old hose was probably just fine.

"I've deducted that the new cable should run from the winch around THE AFT/BACKSIDE of the turning ball, then down through the tube to the keel. Is this correct?"

You have deduced almost correctly. The cable goes down through the tube and around the aft side of the turning ball as it changes direction as the keel moves FORWARD while being lowered.

"My new one touches the winch, though it fits within the spool. Should I cut it down a fraction so it doesn't make any contact?"

I had the same problem, when I replaced mine. I think the CD spec for replacement hose is about an inch too long. Here is what I did. I cut the hose off, so it would not reach the drum of the winch. Then I got a 1 inch length of thick wall pvc pipe that was the same diameter as the hose. I hacksawed a slice out of the side and squeezed into the top end of the hose. I used a hose clamp to hold it in place. This modification acts as a protector from any wear and exposure of the wire in the hose material, that might be caused by the cable rubbing on the lip of the hose. The exposed wire could tangle with the keel cable.

"First, can I assume, having bought it from CD, that the cable is the right length, and; second, it seems there should be something at the bare end of the cable where it is clamped to the winch: am I correct, and if so, what do I need?"

It depends on what you mean by the "right" length. It is the factory length, which I have found sailing among crab traps, is not necessarily the "right" length. I went to a local rigger and had him make me one that was 15 ft long. The longer cable has two distinct advantages. First it makes a bigger lay up on the winch drum so the cable lays on top are not bent as much (even less if you have a larger diameter hub). More importantly, though, when (not if) I hook the float of a crab trap on the cable, I can let it out enough, so that the float pops up behind the transom. A boat hook and a knife make short work of getting free without having to dive under the boat.

"...it seems there should be something at the bare end of the cable where it is clamped to the winch: am I correct, and if so, what do I need?"

I just left the end wrapped to keep it from unraveling and clamped it to the wall of the winch drum, using the metal strap and screws that were mounted there. I hope you kept track of how the end of the cable was reeved into the holes on the side of the winch drum. By the way, when you go to reinstall the winch, install it without the drum. It is easier to gain access to the mounting bolts that way. After the winch body is installed, connect the upper end of the cable to the drum and wind it on to the drum while a helper holds some tension on the cable. You might have to rotate the drum in a horizontal plane to eliminate any twist in the cable as you lay it onto the drum. Once you have the slack out of the cable, fit the drum into position on the winch body and insert the 3/8 bolt that serves as the axle and you're done. When you are in the water, you can lower and raise the keel a few times to rewrap the cable under load.

Bob Vick
Caldwell, TX

Boat Name: Over Keel

Model/Year: <1985

Hull No. 13059

Hailing Port: Lake Somerville
03/05/2004 6:35 AM Pacific Time

My turning ball was flat because the cable was run forward instead of aft, as it should be to roll when lowering & raising the keel.

Chip I think the longer the hose the better; especially with your rough water sailing. It is a hole in the bottom of the boat. Even as a lake sailor after skipping a few waves I might find water has found its way in thru the cable hose opening. If I could figure out a sliding stuffing box I would have one on the cable, but the liability out ways the benefit of that ¼ cup of water found only on rough days.
Jim N
Manahawkin

Boat Name: Top Nic

Model/Year: Catalina 22/1977

Hull No. 6821

Hailing Port: Barnegat, NJ
06/12/2004 7:53 PM Pacific Time

I just bought a 77 Catalina 22 and decided to remove the host to examin the turning ball and chain before I launched the boat. When I took the hose off, the turning ball was basically stuck in one position and worn badly only on one side. After further examination I noticed that the keel winch is mounted in such a way that the cable does not come down through the turning ball on center. The keel winch is mounted to the port of the turning ball, so the cable comes into the turing ball at a decent angle and the sideways pressure does not allow the turning ball to turn, and it wears.

I would think that the keel winch should be mounted so the cable enters the turning ball from directly above, or at least close since the amount of cable on the wince will vary the angle? Is this correct?

The keel winch appears to be in very good shape, I am thinking it was replaced at some point. Is it possible that this newer keel winch mounts slightly different that the original keel winch and I need to move the winch to center it better? I have noticed on newer boats the keel winch is mounted more to the starboard side of the boat than my 77.
Ronald Duschenchuk
Sayville NY

Boat Name:

Model/Year: C22 1974

Hull No.

Hailing Port:
06/12/2004 10:00 PM Pacific Time

I just got a new cable from CD along with a new ball and pin and a new hose. I didn't install the old winch and cable but I did purchase it from CD for my boat yard people to install. I did not notice any clamp for the cable to attach to the winch reel. The cable was reeved through a couple of the holes in the reel and was kept captive by bending the cable into a loop with a swaged fitting. I did the same with the new cable-I hope I was doing it the way it was supposed to be done. I also notice that the turning ball's pin and axle hole was of a much smaller diameter than the old one. Do you think this will be a problem? The hose keeps the pin captive in the holes of the "volcano" but it does seem to be a sloppy fit.
Michael Smalter
Webster, NY

Boat Name: Marrakesh

Model/Year: 1986

Hull No. 13645

Hailing Port: Rochester, NY
06/13/2004 4:05 AM Pacific Time

Ronald--Is the Pin sloppy in the ball, or just sloppy in the volcano tube? The first is a problem, the second is probably OK. At one time CD had a smaller pin with a bushing to make it fit the ball well. Then may have forgotten to send you the bushing.

Ronald Duschenchuk
Sayville NY

Boat Name:

Model/Year: C22 1974

Hull No.

Hailing Port:
06/14/2004 4:19 PM Pacific Time

The fit of the pin to the ball is fine. It's the fit of the pin to the openings in the volcano thats not has good as the old one.

Ron
Michael Smalter
Webster, NY

Boat Name: Marrakesh

Model/Year: 1986

Hull No. 13645

Hailing Port: Rochester, NY
06/14/2004 6:55 PM Pacific Time

I think the ball should still work OK as you describe it.
Lowell Richardson, Owner, Catalina Direct
Sacramento CA

Boat Name: Steamboat Willie

Model/Year: 1984

Hull No.

Hailing Port: Folsom Lake
06/14/2004 11:34 PM Pacific Time

Catalina Yachts used the turning ball out of the Catalina 25 on the C-22 also. The C-25 uses a 3/8" pin. When used in a C-22, Catalina used an additional part, a tube inserted as a bushing to bush the 3/8" hole down to a 1/4” pin.

Our turning balls for the C-22 are made from the outset to accommodate the standard 1/4” pin without the need for an additional bushing. It also has a bit more angle on the sides of the groove to prevent chafe.

The hole in your tube which supports the pin (and therefore the turning ball) should be 1/4” diameter. If it is enlarged for any reason, we can supply a C-25 pin and turning ball which are 3/8". Just drill out the holes in your tube to a clean 3/8" diameter, insert the larger C-25 pin and you are on your way.
ERIC
CAMERON PARK,CA

Boat Name: SUNFLOWER

Model/Year: C-22 1970

Hull No. 247

Hailing Port: MARTINEZ
09/06/2004 8:27 PM Pacific Time

I have a problem with the bronze tube that the turning ball is supposed to fit into. Its coroded beyond use and the hole for the ball axle is not even there anymore. Where can I get a new bronze piece to glass into the hull?
Kevin and Pat
Miranda, CA

Boat Name: HOPE

Model/Year: Catalina 22 1971

Hull No. #403

Hailing Port: Miranda, CA
10/11/2005 10:07 PM Pacific Time

After reading this forum we checked our own turning ball and found two slight flat spots. Everything else looked ok. We really wanted to look at the keel cable just above the keel to the turning ball.
To repair the turning ball we found a 1/4 inch threaded bolt about 4 inches long, slipped on the turning ball, then threaded on a nut to secure the turning ball and chuck the the threaded end ot the bolt into a 3/8 variable speed electric drill which we secured in a vise upside-down. We set the drill to a medium slow speed and dressed the grove in the turning ball with the edge of a bastard file until there were no flat spots and it was round. We didn’t really remove very much metal.
We’ll buy a new turning ball when we attack the keel but first we’re going to do a little sailing
 
 
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